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The Lions next play the Ospreys in Swansea in the URC on 30 March 2024, kickoff is at 17:05

SF 2 - South Africa vs Wales

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TunaLion View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 3:16pm
Look, I also am also not massive fans of many of the players in the current SA team and am very biased towards Lions players. Heck, I would personally drop more than half of the current Springbok side in favour of players I prefer (mostly Lions), but then again my team would play an entirely different gameplan and also probably not be in the World Cup final.

So luckily I am not the coach and I have started to give credit where credit is due as Rassie has done more than I would be able to achieve in my wildest dreams. We also need to realize Rassie plays a different game plan to that of the Lions, NZ, etc. So while a player is good in one team with a specific gameplan, doesn't mean he will be good in another team with another gameplan.

The following is a list of players I wouldn't even have in my WC squad, but have proved that they deserve to be there:

- Damian De Allende : probably the form inside centre at this world cup, his defence is outstanding, his workrate excellent (at rucks), he has great positioning, makes meters with every run and scored an insane try vs Wales. Also manages to make excellent steals/penalties from rucks when within our 22. Fits perfectly with Rassie's game plan. It is hard for me to believe how I used to mock this guy, just a few months ago even. I feel ashamed.

- Lukanyo Am : Great defence, high workrate and also steals a few balls at rucks/disrupts ball from opposing runners arms. Deceptively quick and runs good lines.

- Siya Kolisi : Just like we don't understand how the other SA franchises don't see the value in some of our players from past (or present) such as WW / Tecklenburg / Mostert, he has a great workrate and pops up at almost all the rucks, which makes fans not notice him as he doesn't steal the show as he always has his head in a ruck to disrupt the opponents ball and slow it down. The Springboks don't always try to steal the ball, which is strange for me and not in line with the teams I support, however it works for us as those few seconds he disrupts at every ruck is vital for our defence line to get back in shape. Also manages to make at least one or two monster hits every game.

- Vermeulen : Makes a lot of meters every game (most of the semi), excellent ball control at scrums, great in defence and also manages a few monster hits. Not my type of eighthman, but fits the Springboks gameplan like a glove.

- Frans Malherbe : I was pleasently surprised by his stats this past weekend and another player one doesn't always see, but manages to do the unseen dirty work. Has been solid in the scrums at the world cup thus far.

- Mbonambi : Punches above his weight. Excellent line out throwing and great in the mauls. Allround solid player. I also prefer him to start above Marx (even though I rate Marx much higher) as it allows Marx to really thrive against tired the tired opponents in the second half. It is an 80 minute game with 23 man teams go watch Eddie Jones' response to a question about him "dropping" Ford last week, then you will start to understand this reasoning of Marx being on the bench. I only understood why Marx doesn't start after seeing Eddie's response as well to be honest.

- Lood De Jager : Just like Mostert, he tackles everything that moves (see his stats for this year's SR with the Bulls), very solid in general play and excellent target in the lineouts.

- Kolbe : while he would have been in my starting team for evey game this year, we all laughed at his selection last year (me included). Oh boy how he shut us up pretty quickly. Probably the best wing in the world at the momenbt. Great under the high ball, in defence, in attack, has a good boot on him, even tries to counter ruck at times. And manages to make some intercepts and score some ridiculous tries. What more can one want from your wing?

- some other players like Beast, Pollard, Mapimpi, Nkosi, Francois Louw, etc. all proved themselves during the past few games. Maybe weird with Beast starting, but it is the same situation as with Mbonambi. Rassie is ahead of his time with the use of his bench and his selection of a match 23 instead of just loading your starting 15 with the best. I love the term "Bomb Squad" and also fits in with Eddie Jones' comments. Seems as though the two best and tactically astute coaches made it to the final.

Then, there are a few player who I would still not choose, but because of the turnaround of the past two years, I trust Rassie has his reasons. This is players such as Willie Le Roux, Jesse Kriel (injured) & Eben.
Go LIONS!!!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 3:25pm
Originally posted by Leeubok Leeubok wrote:

Tuna you are contradicting yourself. You say look at this years results only, and I am. Against the AB's we drew one and lost one. And the loss was very recent, in the WC pool game. So how can we be better than them if we haven't beaten them yet this year? 




Originally posted by TunaLion TunaLion wrote:

Everyone keeps saying SA is such a boring team, yet we are leading the try scoring stats. Yeah, some teams played one less game, however, even when looking at average tries per game, we are right up there. And our defence is the best in the comp. Only 4 tries conceded.

@Leeubok, once again you are referring to past years and am missing what I am saying. I am speaking about 2019 and not the past 2 years or 10 games head to head vs another team, etc. Currently we are the best Southern Hemisphere team. NZ lost quite heavily to Aus in the RC and finished 3rd, not 2nd. We won the thing and am in the final of the WC. In 2019, we have the better results from all SH teams, hence we are the best SH team for this year. Only 1 loss against NZ's 2 losses (Aus & Eng). Heck, they only beat Arg by 4 points in the first game. I am failing to comprehend how they are better than us in 2019.

I am not contradicting myself, you are unfortunately not reading my posts completely. I did state I am not speaking about head to head results. I said I am referring to this year and my statement is that we are the best team thus far in this year (2019) as we only lost once. I am speaking about all matches of all teams vs all opponents and the year's (2019) achievements.

I don't know how a team ranked 3rd in the RC and lost twice this year (2019) is better than a team that won the RC and is in the WC final and only lost once this year. The only disrepency is that the team who came 3rd in the RC is named NZ and that makes them better (in 2019) than the team that only lost once and won the RC. Just head to head they are better, that does not make them the better team. Our achievements are better than NZ's this year (2019).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote monster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by Leeubok Leeubok wrote:

Tuna you are contradicting yourself. You say look at this years results only, and I am. Against the AB's we drew one and lost one. And the loss was very recent, in the WC pool game. So how can we be better than them if we haven't beaten them yet this year? 


Haha hoe lekker lag ek nou ...... ABs is n world class sport team .... Bokke Engeland ens moet maar eers hulle op n baie meer gereelde basis wen voor ons kan dink ons is n beter span 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote monster Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:25pm
Res van die wereld speel rugby om elke 4 jaar dir wereld beker te wen die ABs speel rugby om elke jaar alles te wen
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:32pm
Originally posted by monster monster wrote:

Originally posted by Leeubok Leeubok wrote:

Tuna you are contradicting yourself. You say look at this years results only, and I am. Against the AB's we drew one and lost one. And the loss was very recent, in the WC pool game. So how can we be better than them if we haven't beaten them yet this year? 


Haha hoe lekker lag ek nou ...... ABs is n world class sport team .... Bokke Engeland ens moet maar eers hulle op n baie meer gereelde basis wen voor ons kan dink ons is n beter span 


Seriously monster, you too? Read my post, I was clearly referring to this year (2019) and SA's achievements this year vs NZ's achievements this year (not head to head or past years or anything like that).
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:33pm
Originally posted by monster monster wrote:

Res van die wereld speel rugby om elke 4 jaar dir wereld beker te wen die ABs speel rugby om elke jaar alles te wen


Except this year (2019)..........
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:35pm
I am speechless guys. Don't know how much more clear I can be in what I am saying. I started underlining and marking things in bold, while repeatedly stating not head to head and that I am referring to only 2019.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote TunaLion Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 4:39pm
Yes, monster, in historical view, NZ is the best ever sportsteam (bestwinning % of all time all that), they are world class, etc, etc, beat us in head to head this year. I am not argueing any of that. My statement from the start was that we achieved more than them this year (2019) and for 2019 is the best SH team (2019) - if one looks at trophies and amount of matches lost (our 1 vs their 2). That is all.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote valie Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 5:07pm
Ek weet nie of dit net ek is nie, maar dit voel vir my asof die All Blacks 2 jaar gelede reeds ge peak het. Ja hulle het die laaste 2 jaar meeste van hul games gewen, maar hulle was in van die toetse teen ons, en teen ander spanne soms vir my vulnerable. In die laaste 2 jaar het hulle ook verloor teen ons, Engeland, n baie average Aus span en teen Ierland.

Engeland was baie Goed Saterdag. Ons was nie goed teen Wallis nie, maar tog effektief.

Ek dink Engeland het volgens hul potensiaal gespeel, en ons nie. Ons kan baie verbeter, maar ek weet nie of Engeland hulle game nog vreeslik kan lig nie. As elke springbok volgens sy vermoe speel, kan ons hulle wen.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Attie Karate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 5:16pm
Originally posted by valie valie wrote:

Ek weet nie of dit net ek is nie, maar dit voel vir my asof die All Blacks 2 jaar gelede reeds ge peak het. Ja hulle het die laaste 2 jaar meeste van hul games gewen, maar hulle was in van die toetse teen ons, en teen ander spanne soms vir my vulnerable. In die laaste 2 jaar het hulle ook verloor teen ons, Engeland, n baie average Aus span en teen Ierland.

Engeland was baie Goed Saterdag. Ons was nie goed teen Wallis nie, maar tog effektief.

Ek dink Engeland het volgens hul potensiaal gespeel, en ons nie. Ons kan baie verbeter, maar ek weet nie of Engeland hulle game nog vreeslik kan lig nie. As elke springbok volgens sy vermoe speel, kan ons hulle wen.


RE: All Blacks- dink Hansen het bietjie foute gemaak. Speel sonder Crotty en Ben Smith was risky en Barret op 7 in semi? Vleuls alhoewel goed, te onervare. So ook Richie op 10. Hy het seker nog nooit daar gespeel op internasionale vlak nie, nou kom try hy dit in WC semi? Confused

Ons was baie goed teen Japan, maar pap teen Wallis, ek wonder (hoop) of Eng nie dalk tenk leeg gemaak het nie. Ek weet nie, maar ek dink nou nie Eng is sulke erge oorweldigende gunstelinge nie. Maar wag, die week is jonk. Eddie moet nog begin met sy stories.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Niela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28-Oct-2019 at 6:46pm
Originally posted by Attie Karate Attie Karate wrote:

Originally posted by valie valie wrote:

Ek weet nie of dit net ek is nie, maar dit voel vir my asof die All Blacks 2 jaar gelede reeds ge peak het. Ja hulle het die laaste 2 jaar meeste van hul games gewen, maar hulle was in van die toetse teen ons, en teen ander spanne soms vir my vulnerable. In die laaste 2 jaar het hulle ook verloor teen ons, Engeland, n baie average Aus span en teen Ierland.

Engeland was baie Goed Saterdag. Ons was nie goed teen Wallis nie, maar tog effektief.

Ek dink Engeland het volgens hul potensiaal gespeel, en ons nie. Ons kan baie verbeter, maar ek weet nie of Engeland hulle game nog vreeslik kan lig nie. As elke springbok volgens sy vermoe speel, kan ons hulle wen.


RE: All Blacks- dink Hansen het bietjie foute gemaak. Speel sonder Crotty en Ben Smith was risky en Barret op 7 in semi? Vleuls alhoewel goed, te onervare. So ook Richie op 10. Hy het seker nog nooit daar gespeel op internasionale vlak nie, nou kom try hy dit in WC semi? Confused

Ons was baie goed teen Japan, maar pap teen Wallis, ek wonder (hoop) of Eng nie dalk tenk leeg gemaak het nie. Ek weet nie, maar ek dink nou nie Eng is sulke erge oorweldigende gunstelinge nie. Maar wag, die week is jonk. Eddie moet nog begin met sy stories.

100% , if you look at my 11/15 analysis . They panicked !!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Leeubok Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 7:27am
Originally posted by TunaLion TunaLion wrote:

I am speechless guys. Don't know how much more clear I can be in what I am saying. I started underlining and marking things in bold, while repeatedly stating not head to head and that I am referring to only 2019.

What you're trying to say is that the bokke have done better than the AB's in competitions this year. We won the rugby champs and made it to the WC final. Head to head they still kick our arse, but they've slipped up in important games this year. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Leeubok Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 7:38am
Originally posted by Niela Niela wrote:

Originally posted by Attie Karate Attie Karate wrote:

Originally posted by valie valie wrote:

Ek weet nie of dit net ek is nie, maar dit voel vir my asof die All Blacks 2 jaar gelede reeds ge peak het. Ja hulle het die laaste 2 jaar meeste van hul games gewen, maar hulle was in van die toetse teen ons, en teen ander spanne soms vir my vulnerable. In die laaste 2 jaar het hulle ook verloor teen ons, Engeland, n baie average Aus span en teen Ierland.

Engeland was baie Goed Saterdag. Ons was nie goed teen Wallis nie, maar tog effektief.

Ek dink Engeland het volgens hul potensiaal gespeel, en ons nie. Ons kan baie verbeter, maar ek weet nie of Engeland hulle game nog vreeslik kan lig nie. As elke springbok volgens sy vermoe speel, kan ons hulle wen.


RE: All Blacks- dink Hansen het bietjie foute gemaak. Speel sonder Crotty en Ben Smith was risky en Barret op 7 in semi? Vleuls alhoewel goed, te onervare. So ook Richie op 10. Hy het seker nog nooit daar gespeel op internasionale vlak nie, nou kom try hy dit in WC semi? Confused

Ons was baie goed teen Japan, maar pap teen Wallis, ek wonder (hoop) of Eng nie dalk tenk leeg gemaak het nie. Ek weet nie, maar ek dink nou nie Eng is sulke erge oorweldigende gunstelinge nie. Maar wag, die week is jonk. Eddie moet nog begin met sy stories.

100% , if you look at my 11/15 analysis . They panicked !!!

Die AB's het juis baie kritiek gekry oor hul te veel ou manne in die span gehad het, wat toe op n stadium begin kleitrap het. 

Praat jy van Richie Mo'unga op 10? Hy het 14 test caps..

Stem oor Barret, daai trick het nie gewerk nie. Dink Eng het net uitstekend gespeel op die dag, en die AB's nie kans gegee om in die game te kom nie. Ek hoop ook maar hulle tank is leeg na daai game..
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Attie Karate Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 8:12am
Originally posted by Leeubok Leeubok wrote:

Originally posted by Niela Niela wrote:

Originally posted by Attie Karate Attie Karate wrote:

Originally posted by valie valie wrote:

Ek weet nie of dit net ek is nie, maar dit voel vir my asof die All Blacks 2 jaar gelede reeds ge peak het. Ja hulle het die laaste 2 jaar meeste van hul games gewen, maar hulle was in van die toetse teen ons, en teen ander spanne soms vir my vulnerable. In die laaste 2 jaar het hulle ook verloor teen ons, Engeland, n baie average Aus span en teen Ierland.

Engeland was baie Goed Saterdag. Ons was nie goed teen Wallis nie, maar tog effektief.

Ek dink Engeland het volgens hul potensiaal gespeel, en ons nie. Ons kan baie verbeter, maar ek weet nie of Engeland hulle game nog vreeslik kan lig nie. As elke springbok volgens sy vermoe speel, kan ons hulle wen.


RE: All Blacks- dink Hansen het bietjie foute gemaak. Speel sonder Crotty en Ben Smith was risky en Barret op 7 in semi? Vleuls alhoewel goed, te onervare. So ook Richie op 10. Hy het seker nog nooit daar gespeel op internasionale vlak nie, nou kom try hy dit in WC semi? Confused

Ons was baie goed teen Japan, maar pap teen Wallis, ek wonder (hoop) of Eng nie dalk tenk leeg gemaak het nie. Ek weet nie, maar ek dink nou nie Eng is sulke erge oorweldigende gunstelinge nie. Maar wag, die week is jonk. Eddie moet nog begin met sy stories.

100% , if you look at my 11/15 analysis . They panicked !!!

Die AB's het juis baie kritiek gekry oor hul te veel ou manne in die span gehad het, wat toe op n stadium begin kleitrap het. 

Praat jy van Richie Mo'unga op 10? Hy het 14 test caps..

Stem oor Barret, daai trick het nie gewerk nie. Dink Eng het net uitstekend gespeel op die dag, en die AB's nie kans gegee om in die game te kom nie. Ek hoop ook maar hulle tank is leeg na daai game..


Daai ou amnne was steeds great in SR, maar nou ja. Dis maar hul saak.

Nee sorry, Barret op 7.

Ek worry nou nie verder oor die ABs nie.

Go Bokke!!!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote gertjie0000 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 8:22am
Weet nie of julle manne die deal gesien het van Sonnybil nie dis 'n span in canada as hy dit vat is hy die beste betaalde rugby en rugby league spelers 6.2miljoen dollar vir 'n twee jaar kontrak dis so tussen 80 en 90 miljoen rand lekker aftrede pakket Big smile



https://www.sport24.co.za/Rugby/RugbyWorldCup2019/sonny-bill-mulls-mega-money-wolfpack-offer-report-20191029
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Niela Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 8:26am
The 2 teams that made it to the final have had a very consistent team.

in RWC you need consistency. Obviously you cant keep all the players even if they keep on not performing, but the bulk (80%) must stick. 

We've done that and so did england.

New Zealand made 8 changes PLUS 3 positional changes since losing to the boks in 2018. 11/15 changed. 

Steve Hansen pushed his "Innovation" to far, the Barret and Mo'unga thing could have worked, but he should implemented it earlier. 

He effectively dropped Ben Smith to make space for Mo'unga. Then he dropped Ioane , the world player of the year in 2017. 

Ben Franks, probably the best 3 in the world, also didn't make the cut, because he opted for "running props".

Hindsight is a perfect science , but NZ lost the plot a little.

Rassie on the other hand is a little "too loyal". Willie le Roux , case and point. He has been absolutely terrible!!






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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lion4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 9:53am
Originally posted by Niela Niela wrote:

The 2 teams that made it to the final have had a very consistent team.

in RWC you need consistency. Obviously you cant keep all the players even if they keep on not performing, but the bulk (80%) must stick. 

We've done that and so did england.

New Zealand made 8 changes PLUS 3 positional changes since losing to the boks in 2018. 11/15 changed. 

Steve Hansen pushed his "Innovation" to far, the Barret and Mo'unga thing could have worked, but he should implemented it earlier. 

He effectively dropped Ben Smith to make space for Mo'unga. Then he dropped Ioane , the world player of the year in 2017. 

Ben Franks, probably the best 3 in the world, also didn't make the cut, because he opted for "running props".

Hindsight is a perfect science , but NZ lost the plot a little.

Rassie on the other hand is a little "too loyal". Willie le Roux , case and point. He has been absolutely terrible!!






Agree, re Willie, but he is showing glimpses of coming back to some sort of form. Currently he is the Earl Rose of the Bokke. Brilliant one moment and abysmal the next.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Transvaal Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 10:03am
Amper verstik ek in my koffie toe ek Earl Rose se naam lees...nou moet ek seker weer terapie kry om van hom te probeer vergeet....donker tyd in die Leeus se geskiedenis
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote emiel1 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 10:39am
Dink die Bokke het 'n beter kaans teen Engeland as teen die AB's, veral as ons verdediging hulle in foute in kan forseer. Maar ons sal drasties moet verbeter en die Rose sal ook 'n afdag moet he.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Tin Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 10:52am
Originally posted by Transvaal Transvaal wrote:

Amper verstik ek in my koffie toe ek Earl Rose se naam lees...nou moet ek seker weer terapie kry om van hom te probeer vergeet....donker tyd in die Leeus se geskiedenis

LOLLOL
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Lion4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 29-Oct-2019 at 11:03am
Originally posted by Transvaal Transvaal wrote:

Amper verstik ek in my koffie toe ek Earl Rose se naam lees...nou moet ek seker weer terapie kry om van hom te probeer vergeet....donker tyd in die Leeus se geskiedenis
LOLLOLLOL
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